SO LEDAD: I’M SOLEDAD O’BRIEN. WELCOME TO MATTER OF FT.AC THINKING ABOUT QUITTING YOUR JOB? READY TO RESIGN? IF SO, YOU COULD BECOME PARTF O WHAT’S BEING CALLED THE GREAT RESIGNATION. AN OUTGROWTH OF THE ECONOMIC DISRUPTION CAUSED BY THE PANDEMIC. OF COURSE, THERE’S ALSO INFLATION AND SOARING UNEMPLOYMENT RATES. AND YET, EMPLOYERS ARE STRUGGLING TO FILL JOBS. A RECORD NUMBER OF WORKERS FOUR MILLION OF THEM LEFT JOBS IN APRIL. AND WHEN WE LOOK AT APRIL, MAY, AND JUNE NUMBERS ALL TOGETHER NEARLY 11.5 MILLION WORKERS QUIT. MANY WORKERS ARE LOOKING FOR BETTER WORKI CNGONDITIONS, BETTER WORK/LIFE BALANCE, AND BETTER P.AY I’M JOINED NOW BY ANTHONY KLOTZ, PROFESSOR OF MANAGEMENT AT TEXAS A&M UNIVERSITY. SOLEDAD: PROFESSOR ANTHONY KLOTZ, SO NICE TO TALK TO YOU. THANK YOU FOR JOINING ME. YOU’RE THE GUY WHO COINED THE TERM THE GREAT RESIGNATION. AND I’SOM CURIOUS ABOUT WHEN YOU SAW THIS TREND COMING. ANTHONY KLOTZ: IT WAS LATE 2200 LATE LAST YEAR AS THE PANDICEM WAS STILL GOING ON. I WAS OBSERVING FOUR DIFFERENT TRENDS THAT I THOUGHT MIGHT COME TOGETHER TO LEAD TO HIGHER TURNOVER OR A WAVEF O RESIGNATIONS THE FIRST OF WHICH WAS IN 2020, THERE WAS A LARGE DECREASE IN RESIGNATIONS, WHICH MAKES SENSE BECAUSE IT WAS A TIME OF UNCERTAINTY.N I ADDITION, THERE WERE WIDESPREAD REPORTS OF BURNOUT ACROSS ALL SECTORS OF THE ECONOMY, INCLUDING INDIVIDUALS WORKING FROM HOME AND BURNOUT AS A PR EDICTOR OF PEOPLE QUITTING THEIR JOBS. IN ADDITION, INDIVIDUALS WERE HAVING SORT OF LIKE THE SSEOROFT PANDEMIC EPIPHANIES AND BIG THOUGHTS ABOUT LIFEIV POT DURING THE PANDEMIC. AND THEN FINALLY, A LOT OF INDIVIDUALS WHO WERE WORKING FROM HOME. I KNEW THEER WOULD BE SOME PERCENTAGE THAT WOULD RATHER LEAVE THEIR JOBS THAN GO BACK TO WORKING IN PERSON. AND IT SORT OF SEEMED LIKE WE WERE ON THE CUSP OF A GREAT RESIGNATION AS A RESULT OF THOSE. SOLEDAD: THIS DISRUPTION OR RESHUFFLING, HOWEVER YOU WANT TO INTHK ABOUT IT, IS IT ALL GOOD? IS IT ALL BAD? ANTHONY KLOT FZ:OR EMPLOYEES, THIS IS A MOMENT WHERE THEY MIGHT HAVE MORE OPRTPOUNITIES TO WORK IN DIFFERENT AREAS. COMING OUT OF THE PANDEMIC. THERE’S THIS WIDE ARRAOFY WORK ARRANGEMENTS THAT COMPANIES ARE OFFERING, RANGING FROM HYBD TORI REMOTE WORK TO WORK FROM HOME. THESE COMPANIES HAVE BEEN FOCUSED ON GETTING THROUGH THE PANDEMIC AND NOW SHIFTING FOCUS TO THE GREAT RESIGNATION TAKES A MOMENT. BUT IN THAT RESPSEON, YOU CAN SEE ORGANIZATIONS RAISING WAGES, IMPROVING BENEFITS, AND TAKING EMPLOYEE WELLBEING AND MENTAL HEALTH MORE SERIOUSLY THAN MAYBE THEY VEHA IN THE PAST. SOLEDAD: I WAS SURPRISED TO ESE THAT THE BIGGEST GROUP OF PEOPLE WHO ARE RESIGNING SEEMEDO T BETWEEN 30 AND 45 YEARS D,OL RIGHT? SO THOSE ARE MID-CAREER EMPLOYEES. AND THE BIGGEST PLACE, PLACES, HEALTH CARE, TOTALLY GET THAT ONE. BUT TECH? EXPLAIN THAT. ANTHONY KLOTZ: WELL, THERE ARE SO IN HEALTH CARE, YOU MEAK SENSE FROM A BURNOUT PERSPECTIVE, BUT WHEN IT COMES TO TECH, THESE, THESE ARE SOME OF THE MOST DESIRABLE EMPLOYEES WITH THE MOST JOB OPTIONS OUT THERE. AND SO, WHEN IT COMES TO RESIGNING, YOU MIGHT THINK TO YOURSELF, ’BEFORE I QUIT, WHAT AM I GOING TOO? D CAN I GET BACK INTO THE WORKFORCE IF I DECIDE MY SABBATICAL ENDS EARLY OR WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO DOEX NT?’ AND SO, FOR TECH WORKERS THERE’S JUST THIS REALLY ROBUST MARKET, ESPECIALLY IF YOU’RE A TALENTED TECH WORKER. AND SO, THERE’S PROBABLY LESS RISK FOR THEM RESIGNING LESS OF A CONSIDERATION FOR THEM TO HAVE. AND THE TECH COMPANIES HAVE BEEN PROBABLY THE MOST AGGRESSIVE IN TERMS OF CHANGING THEIR WORK ARRANGEMENTS. SOLEDAD: TALK TO ME A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE UPDESIS AND THE DOWNSIDES OF THE ABILITY TO WORK REMOTELY. ANTHONY KLOTZ: WORKING REMOTELY GIVES US THE FREEDOM TO ARRANGE OUR WORK IN THE WAY WE WANT AIN WAY THAT THAT BEING IN THE OFFICE JUST CAN’T MATCH. AND SO, WE REALLY ENJOY THAT FREED.OM SOLEDAD: AND YOU HAVE THE FREEDOM TO DO IT ALL DAY FROM SEVEN O’OCCLK IN THE MORNING UNTIL NINE O’CLOCK AT NIGHT. ANTHONY KLOTZ: SO THAT GETS INTO SOME OF THE CONS, RIGHT? SO,O S OUR WORKDAY HAS DEFINITELY EXPANDED TO KEEP UP PRODUCTIVITY, SO YOU MHTIG START CHECKING EMAIL EARLIER AND THEN INTERSPERSED YOUR DAY WITH DIFFERENT ACTIVITIES. AND THERE IS ZOOM FATIGUE. AND OF COURSE, CHILDCARE AORNY SORT OF CAREGIVING DUTIES IS DIFFICULT WHEN IT COMES TO BALANCING A JOB AT HOME AND TAKING ON OSTHE RESPONSIBILITI.ES SOLEDAD: WHO’S GOING TO WIN OUT OF THIS? ANTHONY KLOTZ: I THINK THERE IS A WIN-WIN OUTCOMTOE TS,HI OR ONE SILVER LINING OF THE PANDEMIC COULD BE THIS WIN-WIN OUTCOMES FOR ORGANIZATIONS THAT REALIZE THIS IS CHA ANCE TO RETHINK WORK. HOW CAN WE REDESIGN WORK IN A WAY THAT REALLY ENGAGES OUR EMPLOYEES. IF THERE IS ANYTHING THAT SORT OF WORRIED ME WOULD WORRY ME, IT'’ THAT REMOTE WORK, YOU KNOW, OPENS YOU UP TO A GLOBAL MARTKE OF COMPETITION. SO, YOU’RE NO LONGER MAYBE COMPETING FOR A JOB THWI PEOPLE IN YOUR SAME MARKET. YOU’RE COMPETING WITH INDIVIDUALS AROUND THE W