Judge Napolitano: Does Trump want Giuliani causing chaos?
Fox News senior judicial analyst, Judge Andrew Napolitano reacts to new questions surrounding the Mueller probe and unleashes on President Trump's legal team on 'The Story.'
This is a rush transcript from "The Story," June 4, 2018. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
SHANNON BREAM, FOX NEWS CHANNEL HOST: I'll see you back here at 11:00 p.m. for "Fox News @ Night." "The Story" with Martha MacCallum out of New York is up next.
MARTHA MACCALLUM, FOX NEWS CHANNEL HOST: Thank you so much, Shannon. So Bill Clinton back on the hot seat.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With everything that's going on with the MeToo Movement, how would you have approached the accusations differently?
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MACCALLUM: Oh boy, 20 years later in the MeToo world, watch as Bill Clinton/Monica Lewinsky's the Oval Office scandal look like now. A prominent Senator and Clinton supporter who may run for President says he should have left office. But the former President became agitated and said no he would do nothing differently.
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BILL CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I don't think it would be an issue because people would be using the facts and still the imagined facts. If the facts are the same today, I wouldn't.
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MACCALLUM: So he went on to say that the MeToo Movement is "long overdue" but critics are using it against him, he believes, in part because of President Trump.
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CLINTON: I think partly because they're frustrated that they got all these serious allegations against the current occupant of the Oval Office and his voters don't seem to care. I think I did the right thing and defended the Constitution.
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MACCALLUM: Then it got a little bit heated.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Through the lens of MeToo now, do you do you think differently or feel more responsibility?
CLINTON: No I felt terrible then. Nobody believes that I got out of that for free. I left the White House $16 million in debt. You are giving one side and a living past.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. President I'm not -- I'm not trying to present aside.
CLINTON: You think President Kennedy should resign? Do you believe President Johnson should resign? Someone should ask you these questions because of the way you formulate the questions.
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MACCALLUM: Very interesting questions on both sides there. Joining me now, David Bossie, former Deputy Campaign Manager for President Trump, Presidents of Citizens United and a Fox News Contributor who spent time as a lead investigator on congressional probes into the Clinton White House, and Lanny Davis former Special Counsel to President Bill Clinton who became well known for defending him during the Lewinsky scandal. He is also the Author of the new book the 'Unmaking of the President 2016.' Gentlemen, welcome. Great to have both of you with us tonight. You both have a lot of experience in this area and with these investigations so Lanny, let me begin with you. Does President Clinton need a new answer to that question now?
LANNY DAVIS, FORMER LAWYER OF PRESIDENT CLINTON: Well I'm only going to give one comment on this topic. President Clinton apologized to the American people publicly. He apologized to Miss Lewinsky and her family publicly and he apologized to his wife and family. And by the time he left office, the American people's judgment was a 65 percent approval rating, the highest of any second term president since polls were invented. That's about all I want to say about that topic.
MACCALLUM: Understood. You know, David let me get your response to this. It's also interesting that you know, the part where he says I left the White House $16 million in debt, Don Trump Jr. tweeted about that today. He said, "Did Bill Clinton just MeToo Monica Lewinsky? I almost have no words. Props for him always being ahead of the curve as the first male to publicly somehow claimed victimhood from his actions against women. Ballsy! Stupid but ballsy!" says Donald Trump Jr. Your thoughts, David.
DAVID BOSSIE, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Well, it's Bill Clinton it's perfect quintessential Bill Clinton. He's the victim here. He's the victim as the President of the United States who used his position of power over a 20- year old intern. He's the victim after all these years. It's ridiculous. Bill Clinton only -- Bill Clinton only admitted the truth which was that he had an affair with Monica Lewinsky only because the special prosecutor got a subpoena to draw his blood to force him to admit that he left physical evidence on a blue dress. That is how disgusting we -- the facts were that we had to deal with in the 90s.
MACCALLUM: All right. You know Lanny, in terms of the broader investigation, at the time you fought very hard against the Independent Counsel Ken Starr. You said that he was out of control, that there wasn't a scintilla of evidence against Bill Clinton in the Paula Jones case, and now Mark Penn who also worked in the Clinton White House, he's very concerned about this. He says I lived through it in 1998 and I think it's wrong and I think it's what's happening again. Do you agree with Mark Penn.? I have no idea what Mark said. He is a good friend of mine and I have no idea what quotes he's using.
MACCALLUM: Well, he's written about five or six columns that basically he thinks this investigation is out of control.
DAVIS: I just said, I have no idea what Mark Penn said. He's a good friend of mine. This investigation has been going on for one year and at one year into Watergate President Nixon said, one year is enough, let's close the investigation. One year later he resigned. I think Mr. Mueller is highly respected. Trey Gowdy who I never thought I would quote, David, in praise after what he did on Benghazi, Trey Gowdy has told President Clinton -- President Trump the following, if you're not guilty then act like it. So let's let Mr. Mueller do his job.
BOSSIE: Lanny, let me just correct you on one thing and that is that this investigation will have been going on for two years this August, two years. The House and Senate started their investigations in August of 16. Let's not forget that. So yes, Mueller has been in office over -- just over a year but this investigation has been going on for two years, Lanny.
DAVIS: Thank you. One year.
BOSSIE: No, no. Lanny, it's been going on for two years and there's been no evidence whatsoever of any collusion and that's what this investigation was about. It wasn't about you know, Paul Manafort and what he did ten years ago even though he was -- he was -- he's you know, going to be convicted it looks like on other issues, has nothing to do with the president and the campaign's collusion. That's what the President's point. He didn't do anything wrong.
MACCALLUM: And also just to -- Lanny, you know, that was an interview that I did with Trey Gowdy, the part that doesn't get picked up a whole lot was that he doesn't -- he said I don't think President Trump did anything wrong. He said from everything we're seeing, there's no indication that he did anything wrong.
DAVIS: I don't think -- I don't think it's certainly fair because we haven't seen the facts yet. My friend David Bossie who you had to come --
MACCALLUM: But you say he should be impeached? Wait a minute, Lanny, you just said he should be impeached. You said President Trump should be impeached and then you just said in his last breath that you don't think you have all the facts.
DAVIS: Who just said he should be impeached? I did not say that.
MACCALLUM: You have said that.
DAVIS: I have said he should be investigated. I don't know whether he should be impeached. My book which thank you for mentioning, Martha, calls for an investigation and my friend David Bossie, we have become friends over the years forgot to mention that Ken Starr investigated Bill Clinton and Mrs. Clinton for seven years and $16 million dollars and back then David wasn't complaining.
BOSSIE: Well that's because Bill Clinton had one problem after another. It was one of the most corrupt administration that we ever saw. You look at how many independent counsels there were Lanny. Look at how many different investigations were because there was corruption at every turn. This is an investigation you know, looking for some facts but there's none there. And that's been the president's point the entire time.
MACCALLUM: Let me --
DAVIS: Let's wait for the -- let's wait for the facts to come out. But by the way, David, the last independent counsel after Mr. Starr found no evidence of any criminal wrongdoing by either Mrs. Clinton despite all your efforts ended up in a big zero.
MACCALLUM: All right, let me ask you about James Comey because I know that in your book --
DAVIS: Thank you.
MACCALLUM: -- 'The Unmaking of the President 2016,' and by that you mean Hillary Clinton because you believe that James Comey's actions toward the end of the campaign literally unmade her opportunity to be -- to be President and you believe he lied, how so?
DAVIS: Well, this is where again David and I may actually agree on something. Comey lied when he said he was obligated to show the Congress that he was investigating the emails because of what he testified to when all he actually said and he knows that this is all he said is I will look at. When he finally looked at six days later, as we all know as a matter of history, he found nothing there and on November six two days before the election, he told us there was nothing there. I also agree that he should have been fired but by President Obama because he violated Justice Department fundamental rules. I don't agree with President Trump's reason for firing but he should have been fired.
MACCALLUM: All right, and just to be clear at this point you do not believe that there should be impeachment proceedings against President Trump?
DAVIS: Not without an investigation. I want to see what the facts are after a thorough investigation. I'd like it to be a bipartisan judgment rather than a partisan one which is what occurred to Bill Clinton in 1998.
MACCALLUM: Understood.
BOSSIE: And Martha, that's why we need Republicans to keep control of the House because that's the only way there won't be impeachment. The Democrats have no policy positions, they have no agenda other than to impeach this President, to end his remarkable agenda and his successes.
MACCALLUM: All right guys, thank you.
DAVIS: Remarkable. Considering pardoning himself.
MACCALLUM: Thank you. I know, you're not going to agree on that one. Lanny, thank you. David, thank you both. Great to have you here. 'The Unmaking of the President 2016' is Lanny Davis's new book. Coming up tonight, a senator stokes the flames of the immigration debate.
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MERKLEY: The administration says they're tearing this children away from their parents (INAUDIBLE) have to protect them but instead to assault and inflict hurt.
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MACCALLUM: That was one of his staffers who was shooting that whole thing. He got a million hits on the internet today for that but what's the real story behind Senator Jeff Merkley's viral visit to immigration facilities that are housing illegal minors. Ben Shapiro says it's ridiculous. He'll be here with that argument in a moment. Also, judge, Andrew Napolitano unleashes on the -- on the Trump legal team next
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RUDY GIULIANI, LAWYER OF PRESIDENT TRUMP: The President of the United States pardoning himself would just be unthinkable and it would -- it would lead to probably particularly an immediate impeachment.
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MACCALLUM: It just came in, President Trump was supposed to welcome the Super Bowl 52 champions Philadelphia Eagles to the South Lawn of the White House. It's a tradition, it happens every year, but it appears that it is not going to be happening. This week the president just released this statement moments ago saying this in part, "The Philadelphia Eagles are unable to come to the White House with their full team to be celebrated tomorrow. They disagree with their president, the President writes, because he insists that they proudly stand for the National Anthem hand on heart in honor of the great men and women of our military and the people of our country" so no big moment for the Eagles. I won't be crying too much over that one as you know but it turns out that the Eagles will not be -- here's another reason you know, but anyway we dragged breast so there's that. If we're getting more, we'll let you know. And breaking tonight a confidential new memo just revealed that President Trump's lawyers sent to Special Counsel Robert Mueller back in January. Remember this is the old legal team that sent this. This is Rudy Giuliani made the Sunday show round saying that the president could pardon himself but that he wouldn't. Chief National Correspondent Ed Henry live at the White House with the story for us tonight. Hi Ed!
ED HENRY, FOX NEWS CHANNEL CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Martha, great to see you. President Trump really raised in the stakes tonight by declaring the special council's probe is in his words unconstitutional and that he has the power to pardon himself if he wants suggesting there may be major clashes ahead not just with Robert Mueller but maybe the Congress and the Supreme Court as well. The president made clear he does not expect to pardon himself because he says he's done nothing wrong closely matching the message this weekend of his lead attorney Rudy Giuliani who raised the specter of this but then added it was unthinkable the President would do it because it would likely lead to impeachment.
Now, key Trump advisers tell me important part of what Giuliani is doing with the president's blessing is signaling to Mueller there's still a chance, a small chance of a one-on-one interview but only if questions are severely limited and this is a warning shot that if the special counsel wants to instead issue a subpoena to compel the president to testify, he's ready for a battle in court. And I can tell you, the president offered a competitive tone as he did a phone call just a short time ago with the Minnesota Republican Party celebrating the accomplishments of his first 500 days in office. Listen.
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DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We have a lot of people against us. We have that phony Russian witch hunt which is finally becoming discredited because that's what it is. It's a discredited disgrace. It's not even constitutional in a lot of people's opinion and in my opinion too.
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HENRY: Now as you noted this battle of course comes in the context of an extraordinary 20 page memo sent to the Special Counsel back in January by two of the president's personal attorneys at the time John Dowd who's now out, Jay Sekulow who's still in asserting the president cannot really obstruct justice because he has the power to shut the investigation down whenever he wants. The memo also states the president himself dictated a statement that turned out to be misleading about his son Donald Trump Jr's 2016 meeting at Trump Tower with Russians. That conflicts with Sarah Sanders and what Jay Sekulow last year said minimizing the president's role in drafting that statement yet I can tell you a former deputy to Independent Counsel Kenneth Starr told Fox the memo is helpful to the president. Watch.
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SOL WISENBERG, FORMER DEPUTY INDEPENDENT COUNSEL: It's the leaking of the letter which I absolutely believed had to have come from the camp of the President that I think it's so such a brilliant maneuver because it shows a number of things. First, it shows that the Mueller -- the Mueller team's view of obstruction of justice is frighteningly broad.
SARAH HUCKABEE SANDERS, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: He certainly didn't dictate but you know, he like I said he weighed in and offered suggestion like any father would do.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HENRY: Now, that was last year. Today at the podium, Sarah Sanders again said the president did not dictate that statement even though his own legal team in January said he did dictate the statement. Martha?
MACCALLUM: OK. Ed, thank you very much for the update from the White House tonight. So Judge Andrew Napolitano joins us now. Fox News senior judicial analyst. Judge, what do you think?
ANDREW NAPOLITANO, FOX NEWS CHANNEL SENIOR JUDICIAL ANALYST: I think that the letter was a disgrace and harmful --
MACCALLUM: The January memo?
NAPOLITANO: The January memo. I don't know how it got out. I don't know why the White House would have leaked it as has been suggested because it shows a really a sophomoric view of the law. They cited the wrong statute and they interpreted the wrong -- the wrong opinion. They interpreted an appeals court opinion rather than the Supreme Court. They're basically saying two things. The president can't commit obstruction of justice because he can order anybody prosecuted, he can stop any prosecution, he can fire anybody wants. He can, but if he does so for a corrupt purpose that would be the definition of obstruction of justice. They forgot that part. Second argument they make is that he can interfere with an FBI investigation that's not obstruction of justice. They forgot that the statute they said it was amended in 2002 you know, sixteen years ago to say that in the interference with an FBI investigation intended to produce evidences --
MACCALLUM: These are the lawyers for the president of the United States. I mean, you would think that he would have a really good legal team. He doesn't have this legal team anymore, and now he has Rudy Giuliani and Jay Sekulow.
NAPOLITANO: It is difficult for me to-- it is difficult for me to criticize them because I know them all personally and have interacted with them. Even Jay here and the others in other environments but they are not serving him well. When they needlessly show their cards, when they make arguments like he can impeach himself -- why even raise that issue? And Rudy Giuliani who was --
MACCALLUM: He could pardon himself.
NAPOLITANO: Correct. A brilliant prosecutor suggesting that the president could have ordered James Comey to be shot in the Oval Office and that he could not be prosecuted for that that is absurd and a violation of the law. He could be arrested, charged, indicted, released, tried after he leaves the White House but no way would any law-enforcement agency allow a murder or an attempted murder to go uncharged because the person behind it was the president and Giuliani knows that.
MACCALLUM: Well, what's your recommendation? What your -- I mean, should he fire Rudy Giuliani for that?
NAPOLITANO: I don't know because they have a relationship with which I'm unfamiliar. Perhaps the President wants Rudy causing this chaos but he is causing chaos and he's causing people like you and me and our colleagues here and elsewhere to be talking about these absurd off-the-wall things like can the President pardon himself. Why would the president want anybody discussing that?
MACCALLUM: It's the 500th day of the presidency and the president tweeted one tweet about that talking about you know, how -- well he feels he's got so much accomplished but he didn't you know, probably nine or ten over the weekend about all of this.
NAPOLITANO: The president -- the president has much of which to be proud on his fifth -- on his 500th day in office but whether or not he should pardon himself is not among them. And most respectfully, if Bob Mueller's office is unconstitutional, why did you sanction the Russians that he indicted and why are your lawyers interacting with an unconstitutional entity? I don't know what the -- what his answers would be.
MACCALLUM: Good argument. Judge, thank you very much.
NAPOLITANO: You're welcome.
MACCALLUM: Good to see you tonight.
NAPOLITANO: It's always a pleasure. Happy Monday!
MACCALLUM: Thank you.
NAPOLITANO: You just don't like the Eagles because they beat the Patriots.
MACCALLUM: Exactly. Is that a problem?
NAPOLITANO: God love your --
MACCALLUM: I have a lot of reasons but --
NAPOLITANO: God loves your honesty.
MACCALLUM: Thank you very much. All right, so joining me now Jonathan Swan, national political reporter for Axios. Jonathan, great to have you here tonight. Thanks for being here. You know, one of the issues that the judge and I didn't get to is this issue of the dictation by the president of the response to Donald Juniors June 16th meeting at Trump Tower. Why is it problematic that he would have been involved in that?
JONATHAN SWAN, NATIONAL POLITICAL REPORTER, AXIOS: It was problematic in the first instance because the statement was misleading and --
MACCALLUM: How is it misleading?
SWAN: That they said -- they said it was about Russian adoption, the meeting that Don Junior had with these Russians and obviously that was --
MACCALLUM: But wasn't that --
SWAN: That was a pretext.
MACCALLUM: No, I understood but you know, wasn't that something that the Russian lawyer and that group had been lobbying for and working on for a long time?
SWAN: No question but as the Trump team would now acknowledge, the meeting also included some other fairly relevant things including emails to set it up which Don Junior agreed with saying that they had --
MACCALLUM: Right, that they love it, yes. You know, please come out, I love it.
SWAN: I think you know, it's so --
MACCALLUM: But is it possible -- I've always been curious about this that's why I'm asking this because it's possible that that's what they lured him with and they wanted to talk to him about the other thing they didn't really have any dirt. But they wanted to get him in the room and they figured that would work and the president said you know, who wouldn't take that meeting in today's politics?
SWAN: So -- but to your question, I don't know that it's legally problematic. I mean it's not illegal to lie to the news media, it's not illegal to lie to the New York Times and the president, of course, hasn't spoken to Bob Mueller and as Rudy Giuliani continually reminds us, one of the reasons he hasn't spoken to Bob Mueller, one the reasons his legal team has been restraining that is because they don't want him to be perjured, to perjure himself. And so this is -- Rudy Giuliani has literally said that out loud. He said that you know, these shifting explanations, misleading statements, this is why we don't want the president being interviewed by Bob Mueller.
MACCALLUM: All right, so what's your sense at the White House right now about how they feel about all of this? Because today you know, all of the conversation as I just said, it's the 500th day in office but all the conversation is about these comments over the weekend, the president saying that he could pardon himself if he wanted to, that the investigation itself is unconstitutional, as far as message structuring goes this is a failure.
SWAN: So there's like two parts to this thing. Whenever I read you know, the White -- this is the mood in the White House about the Russian investigation, it's nonsense. They don't talk about it. It's like the one thing -- Russia is the one word nobody in the West Wing talks about. They don't have meetings about it. In fact, if there's any mention of it, people try and leave the room. It's like the word that no one wants anything to do with. And that being said, there is this dynamic particularly in the White House press shop and comes to where they're watching the show like the rest of us. They have no earthly idea what Rudy Giuliani is going to say, you know, to whoever in the next minute or on T.V. tonight. It is this completely separate operation. And honestly, they view it as a circus, a lot of them. They see this, they don't really know what's going on. They don't know what he's going to say. They assume that there is a coordination between Rudy Giuliani and the president but I think they're very happy to be out of it and to have nothing to do with it and leave it to those guys. And the more we can just say as spokespeople for the White House, you know, I defer to the president's outside counsel, that's the magic sentence for --
MACCALLUM: And you know, you could sense the frustration in the briefing room today.
SWAN: Sure.
MACCALLUM: Sarah Huckabee Sanders basically said look, there's a Chinese wall. You know, we're not the legal team. If you have questions for them, you have to go see -- you have to ask them. And we all know that the legal team does leak from time to time so you can get answers from the legal team if you push hard enough but that's a frustration obviously for the press -- for the Press Corps.
SWAN: It is -- it's a frustration for the press -- you know, remember when John Dowd who wrote that memo you talked about who was one of the authors and the President's former lawyer, I remember when he was giving interviews and I was you know talking to senior people in the White House, pressure up and there was just sort of tearing their hair out. They didn't -- they had no ideas some of this stuff was coming. They had to respond to it. So it's never been coordinated in any way shape or form.
MACCALLUM: Jonathan, thank you. Great to see you tonight.
SWAN: I appreciate it.
MACCALLUM: Jonathan in Washington, great to have you. So still to come tonight, voting across the country tomorrow as the civil war over California plays out in electoral politics in that state. We're going to break down what you need to watch there and in the seven other states for tomorrow night. Plus, a senator crying foul after police confront him. We're trying to get into a detention center where they are holding illegal minors who have been separated from their parents. Bad situation to be sure but Ben Shapiro says that was a publicity stunt. He's here with his take after the break.
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SEN. JEFF MERKLEY, D—OREGON: I want to know if they are having second thoughts about being partners in a process of ripping children away from their families under this new policy.
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JEFF SESSIONS, UNITED STATES ATTORNEY GENERAL: -- prosecute you. And that child will be separated from you probably as required by law. If you don't want your child to be separated, then don't bring them across the border illegally.
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MARTHA MACCALLUM, HOST, FOX NEWS: So that was Attorney General Jeff Sessions last month announcing a new Trump administration policy to refer to every person caught crossing the border illegally for federal prosecution.
And as a result of that action, Senator Jeff Merkley, a Democrat from Oregon, decided to go to the Texas Detention Center over the weekend that's holding some of these illegal minors and try to prove just how bad the situation really is.
And of course, he took along cameras to document his experience. Despite the fact that he had been told in advance that he would not be admitted to that facility. Here is what happened.
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SEN. JEFF MERKLEY, D—OREGON: The reason that I came was this new policy that the attorney general has in place of families that are awaiting for the adjudication of the application of their application for asylum here in the U.S.
And the children will be separated. I think it's important for you all to be aware that it's been in the press all over country that the children previously kept with their families, under a new policy just implemented by the attorney general are being separated from their families and warehoused here.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, we're here, the supervisor is here. If he wants to come on the property he can ask, but he hasn't asked yet.
MERKLEY: OK. If you guys don't mind.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't mind at all.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MACCALLUM: So that's what happened. It went viral as I said. It's all over the internet.
Here now is Ben Shapiro, editor in chief of Dailywire.com. Ben, good to see you as always. Thanks you for being on the show tonight. Your reaction, you said this is a ridiculous stunt. What do you mean?
BEN SHAPIRO, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, DAILYWIRE.COM: Well, I mean it's a ridiculous stunt in the sense that if Congress wants to change the law right now to allow illegal immigrant detainees to stay with their children they could theoretically do that. The Democrats are not moving to do that.
Here is the real issue. The issue is that under American law the ninth circuit court of appeals have said this. When illegal immigrants enter the country with illegal immigrant children, those children are not allowed to be kept in custody longer than 20 days. They must be referred out of the system to some of other guardian figure.
So what that means is that these kids are going to be by law separated from their parents when their illegal parents cross the border. Democrats response to this has been to say that Trump is the one who is forcibly separating these kids from their parents.
But in reality what Democrats mean by that is that what they would like to see is a mass attempt by the Trump administration not to actually enforce the immigration law at all.
So their answer is instead of just releasing these kids and keeping the parents, let's release everybody. Let's release the kids, let's release the parents, let's release everybody. When in reality if you actually want to enforce the immigration law and you want to keep kids with their parents you theoretically could actually make a legal fix for that sort of thing.
MACCALLUM: Yes. It's a great point. Because if you go do through the congressional process and you try to change this you're going to sort of run head long into the entire issue of the immigration reform in this country and say why are we doing this, right?
How is this working? Why are we separating these children? Well, we are separating the children because they come across and in some cases they don't know whether or not the children are actually the children of the parents or whether or not they're being trafficked into the country. There are concerns about these families. In many cases they don't know. And they don't have paperwork. In some cases they can't communicate that properly.
So in some situations these kids are in danger. And it's the worst possible thing to see them, you know, in the holding centers. But you know, in some ways, I mean, do you believe it's true that they brought it on themselves?
SHAPIRO: I don't think that the kids brought it on themselves obviously.
(CROSSTALK)
MACCALLUM: I mean, the families being separated.
SHAPIRO: But actually when the parents come across the border knowing what the status of the law is.
MACCALLUM: Yes.
SHAPIRO: I mean, if the status of the law is what the status of the law is then I'm not sure why that changes based on the president of the United States and this administration enforcing the law.
Again, I would like to see these kids stay with the parents but the easiest way to do that is to change the law to allow the kids to stay with the parents or for the parents to not come illegally in the first place.
Democrats like Merkley are insisting the best way to fix the law is not enforce it at all. Just anyone who comes across the border with a kid we let go straight into society that's why Merkley is in favor of sanctuary cities, this is why he's been in favor of the catch and release policies that allow illegal immigrants parents to be just released and then they never show up for the court date.
If you're going to enforce the immigration law under the ninth circuit court of appeals ruling you must take the kids away from parents. That's not fault of the bunch of conservatives. That's the fault of the bunch of people on the left who sit on the ninth circuit court of appeals and are beloved by the Democrats the world over.
MACCALLUM: Yes. We've been talking about, you know, the number of legal issues that came up over the weekend with the president, with the ability to pardon yourself and all of that, whether it's unconstitutional and the Mueller investigation overall.
And you know, sort of lost in that little shuffle is one tweet from the president saying, it's day 500 of my presidency, you know. And that really could have been, you know, sort of the marquee moment of the day. But you know, because of all these other tweets we're not necessarily talking about it. But I'm curious what you think on day 500. You know, how do you think he is doing?
SHAPIRO: I mean, he has governed more conservatively than I certainly could have imagined. He's the most conservative president of my lifetime. Through his 500 days in terms of policy and I'm extraordinarily happy with President Trump.
In terms of his rhetoric, I mean, you said what he he said about the Twitter. I mean, the Twitter is what the Twitter is. And President Trump's rhetoric is what President Trump's rhetoric is. I think we have a lot of areas to be grateful for in terms of policy. I wish the president could keep his rhetoric habits a little bit more under control and appreciate the winning.
MACCALLUM: And the Philadelphia Eagles decided not apparently, they decided not to go to the White House. And the president says, you know, well, they don't like my policy. What do you think about that?
SHAPIRO: Well, the president has a habit of saying to people well, you can't quit, you're fired. So I'm not particularly shocked by the president's response to all of this. I've never been a fan of the sports teams visiting the White House. It just seems like celebrity culture at its finest. I hate celebrity culture in general.
I don't like Kim Kardashian at the White House. I don't like the Eagles at the White House. I don't like anybody who is famous for the sake of being famous at the White House. It seems to me that this is, again, the people's house where policy should be getting done not a bunch of photo ops, whether it's Obama doing it, or Bush doing it or President Trump doing it.
MACCALLUM: All right. Well, I'm just told that Trump disinvited them so maybe he feels that he is starting to feel the same way about celebrity culture at the White House.
Ben, always good to see you. Thank you so much. Have a good night.
SHAPIRO: Thanks a lot.
MACCALLUM: So tomorrow, eight states will vote in the primaries that could make or break things for President Trump's entire agenda. We're going to take a look at the races that you're going to be want to be watching tomorrow night. And the plan for victory for both sides, next.
Plus, the officer accused of being a coward cop. Failing to stop the Parkland school gunman is now speaking out for the first time to defend his actions.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have possible -- it could be fire crackers. I think we have possible shots fired 1200 building.
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MACCALLUM: All right. Drum roll please. Just hours from now the voters are going to start heading to the polls in eight states in the United States of America including California. Which political watchers believe could determine the control of the House come November because there is so many interesting races going on in California.
So under the state's rules, the top two candidates advance to the general election regardless of party. Meaning, both Democrats and Republicans could be shut out of key contests.
Kayleigh McEnany is the RNC spokesperson. Kayleigh, good to see you tonight. There is so much going on in all of these states across the country. California's fascinating. Tell me what you are watching there.
KAYLEIGH MCENANY, SPOKESPERSON, RNC: You are right, Martha. It's a fascinating state to look at. Because as you mention this is a top two vote-getter system. So in three congressional districts there are so many Democratic candidates vying to become their nominee or to advance in the top two vote-getter round that basically they could be shut out, and we could see Republicans who have a smaller field advance.
And Martha, what is so astonishing to me that the Democratic Party is getting involved in bullying some of their candidates out of the race and using really harsh tactics. And I have to fact check this with our regional team because I couldn't believe it when I read it. That you have one Democratic candidate in the 48th district saying the party officials came to me and said I was too brown to win here and I had to leave the race. It's astonishing that they are sinking to that low.
MACCALLUM: Who is that?
MCENANY: That was Congressman Omar Siddiqui. Omar Siddiqui, a former FBI adviser who is alleging this against Democratic Party in the officials in the 48th district. It's incredible.
MACCALLUM: I mean, what is he doing about that? I mean, is he fighting that? That's unbelievable.
MCENANY: Yes. He's been saying it loudly. It's only been picked up by one source, the Washington Examiner but I've confirmed it with the RNC that he is saying Democratic Party officials have told him this but no one is covering it.
MACCALLUM: I know.
MCENANY: They are using race-baiting and tactics like this to bully out candidates. It's astonishing.
MACCALLUM: It is astonishing. And what about Representative Royce, Ed Royce's seat which is open. That was being called the weirdest race in the country. Why?
MCENANY: It's very weird especially because you have Democrats that are fighting so intensely that the state party chairman, the Democratic state party chairman convened them at an Italian restaurant. In what was described as a, "godfather like dinner" saying we all need to come together and make peace because we are hurting ourselves. So this is how vicious it's gotten. They are having to convene at Italian restaurants to make peace.
MACCALLUM: We hope it doesn't turn out like "The Godfather." In terms of the money that's being spent by the Democrats, I mean, they're, you know, in danger of going bust in California they've dumped so much money in this. Right?
MCENANY: That's right. There are 10 seats that they spent a combined $30 million.
MACCALLUM: Wow.
MCENANY: We spent just a fraction of that. And here's the thing and this is Politico reporting. It's true. We can confirm this at the RNC that our candidates are equipped with millions of dollars in most event when they come out of these races but to avoid this top two vote-getter system, Democrats are wasting all their money and some of their candidates are next to broke. So they've got a lot of trouble. And DNC is broke by the way, too.
MACCALLUM: So what about the RNC in California in terms of holding on to some of those Republican seats, what's your outlook?
MCENANY: Well, one of the things that we are really looking at is this sanctuary state law, it's really taken California by storm. You see more than a dozen districts rising up against the state government saying this is not something we want to tolerate.
This is going to be a key hot button issue for us. We've already seen Kevin de Leon he is challenging Dianne Feinstein. He has fallen in the polls. He is the author of the sanctuary state legislation and we think that that's hurting him and his fall in the polls is illustrative of what's happening statewide.
MACCALLUM: It's going to be fascinating. What about Montana? Because we all remember the president kind of going after Senator Jon Tester during the whole Ronnie Jackson thing, the White House doctor when they wanted him to be the head of the V.A. he really impugned his character and they had a battle over that. The president was tweeting about that everybody remember. What's going on there?
MCENANY: Well, it's interesting because Jon Tester voted against nearly all of President Trump's policies let out his first campaign ad, Martha, his first campaign ad says, "I've put -- can put on two hands the number of bills that I got President Trump to sign." He wasn't with President Trump on tax cuts. He wasn't with President Trump on keeping the government open or any of this other key legislation. Nevertheless he is touting his record with Donald Trump and now he has a green party challenge and he is fighting that in court. So he is in a lot of trouble, Jon Tester.
MACCALLUM: Fascinating to watch. Kayleigh, thank you very much. We'll be watching tomorrow night.
MCENANY: Thanks, Martha.
MACCALLUM: OK. So coming up here, the police officer who was accused of being a coward during the Parkland massacre is now opening up. He is telling his side of the story. But not everyone is buying it. Jeff Bell, president of the Broward County Sheriff Union joins me next.
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SCOT PETERSON, FORMER DEPUTY OFFICER, BROWARD COUNTY: In a perfect world, I would have said, yes, I know there was a shooter there. Let me go to the third floor, find this person.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
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MACCALLUM: This quote, "The bottom line I was there to protect. And I lost 17." That is what the disgraced former school resource officer at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School is now saying. Nearly four months after a gunman murdered 17 people inside that Florida school.
Sheriff Deputy Scot Peterson breaks his silence and questions what he could have done to save lives despite not going into the building to try to find and confront the shooter.
Trace Gallagher live in our west coast newsroom with the back story tonight. Trace.
TRACE GALLAGHER, CORRESPONDENT, FOX NEWS: Martha, The former Broward County deputy Scot Peterson now says he did what he was trained to do. He called in the shooting. He locked down the school. He cleared the kids out of the courtyard.
Peterson says surveillance video and call logs support his story. But the video and the call logs are originally what prompted the sheriff to label him a coward. We know at 2.21 on the afternoon of February 14, Deputy Peterson was in his office when a call came in of a possible firecracker.
Seconds later, a fire alarm went off and Peterson ran toward the 1200 building until a security guard in a golf cart offered him a ride. When Peterson got off the cart he heard two loud bangs. He claimed he didn't know where they came from so he took up a tactical position against the wall of the building near 1200. And at 12:23 he made the first police radio call. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PETERSON: We have possible, it could be firecrackers. I think we got shots fired. Possible shots fired, 1200 building.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GALLAGHER: Twelve hundred. In the next 54 seconds, Peterson made two more calls where he again identified shots being fired in the 1200 building. But now he maintains that while he said 1200 he never pinpointed the location. Never saw the shooter and stayed against the wall so he wasn't exposed.
But according to police surveillance video that has not been released, it does show the attacker discarding his weapon in the stairwell of 1200. And then blending in with other students as they fled the building. Here is Peterson's radio call a full seven minutes after the report of a firecracker. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PETERSON: Do not approach the 1200 or the 1300 building. Stay at least 500 feet away at this point.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GALLAGHER: Everybody stay away. But at that point the victims were all down and the shooter was gone. Here is Scot Peterson now on NBC. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PETERSON: You know, if I would have had, at the point if I would have known, I mean, knowing what I know today, I would have been in that building in a heartbeat. I mean like I said, it was my kids. I mean, it's just I didn't know. I mean, I wrack my brain. I go why?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GALLAGHER: Yet even in hindsight, the sheriff and the police union both agree Peterson should have gone in, addressed the killer and killed the killer. Martha?
MACCALLUM: Unbelievable. Trace, thank you very much. Here with more tonight Broward Sheriff Office Deputy Association president Jeff Bell. Jeff, what goes through your mind when you listen to this man who has now broken his silence and is defending himself?
JEFF BELL, DEPUTY SHERIFF, BROWARD COUNTY: It's shameful to listen to the words that he is speaking today. Deputy Peterson in his 28 out of 32-year law enforcement career spent that as a school resource deputy. I think what he has forgot is how to tell the truth as he is sitting there being a counselor inside of a school instead of law enforcement officer.
Because what he forgets is that facts have to match the story that's being told. And the story that Deputy Peterson is telling does not match the facts that we can clearly see through the dispatch call logs and through the video.
Deputy Peterson was right there a minute after the shooting started. Then listens, continued to listen to the shots go on for another five minutes before he ever took action. And the first tactical bit of information that he put out on the radio was to tell deputies to stay away 500 feet.
MACCALLUM: Yes.
BELL: Which is against all protocol in a sheriff's office. But that also paints a bigger picture of what's going on in the sheriff office that things need to be fixed from a much higher level. And the deputies that are working the ground are just following what they are being told to do from a higher level.
MACCALLUM: Yes, I mean, it's infuriating. This is Andrew Pollack who lost his daughter Meadow. He was on with us on Friday night. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDREW POLLACK, MEADOW POLLACK'S FATHER: The one deputy that worked at the school didn't go in. So he hid behind the wall. And they thought that there was still an active shooter in there because he was still hiding behind the wall, the deputy that was at the building at the time.
So, you know, the paramedics that they had their work cut out from that day because the sheriff at the school didn't do his job.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MACCALLUM: We were talking about the facts that the paramedics were also told they could not go into the building. And no doubt there were children who had been wounded at that point that really could have used that paramedic help. Who has been held accountable in the sheriff's office so far? And in what way?
BELL: Well, Martha, that's what I was trying to say before about the bigger problem here at the sheriff's office. Because nobody has been held accountable. You have the district captain of Parkland, Jan Jordan, who took 11 minutes to get to that scene and had no ability to take a command presence at that crime scene and actually get the resources inside that were needed.
Fire Chief McNally out of Coral Springs went on the record and said that six times he asked Captain Jordan for permission to get fire rescue units and the law enforcement units into that school as the rescue task force units. As we are trained to do, to help save people and save lives.
And six times he was denied to allow those rescue task force to get inside. So it shows the incompetence of the district captain. And those people are being placed in by the sheriff, himself, as political appointees and favoritism and cronyism.
MACCALLUM: Jeff, thank you. We're going to stay on the story and we're going to keep asking the questions until something happens. Thank you very much.
BELL: Thank you.
MACCALLUM: We'll be right back.
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MACCALLUM: Before we leave you tonight, comedian and 'Tonight Show' host Jimmy Fallon delivering a surprise commencement address on Sunday to the Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School graduating class. His words to those graduates are our quote of the night.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JIMMY FALLON, COMEDIAN: When something feels hard, remember that it gets better. Choose to move forward and don't let anything stop you. Sometimes things that seem like setbacks can take our lives and totally new directions they can change in ways we don't expect. Put one foot in front of the other and keep going day by day, moment by moment.
If I could give you one last piece of advice, it would be this. Don't ever get off your parents wireless plan. Ride that train as long as possible.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MACCALLUM: Good for them. And good for him for doing that. He had a strong message and he made them laugh too, which I'm sure they needed. So, good job. So we will be back here tomorrow night. Seven o'clock actually from Washington, D.C. Tucker Carlson is coming up next. See you tomorrow.
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