I first came across Michelle Cable while wedding planning, oddly enough. We loved the vintage soul records that DJ Jonathan Toubin was spinning, and thought his music would be a hit with both our friends and our grandparents (it was). I soon learned that he was represented by Cable's agency, Panache Booking, along with marquee indie artists like Mac DeMarco, Ty Segall, Thee Oh Sees, and my new favorite, Ezra Furman — his show at the Music Hall of Williamsburg after Trump's surprise win was a complete punk catharsis.
I wanted to learn how Cable rose up to run a boutique booking agency producing some of indie rock's most memorable shows, how the live music business works, and what artists should do to succeed. Here's our chat:
Danny Ross: You recently moved to Los Angeles after years in Brooklyn. Should we all be moving there?
Michelle Cable: I've noticed a lot of companies have been moving to L.A. or opening L.A. offices. On my end personally, a lot of the artists I work with are based in California now. Mac DeMarco moved out here, Ty Segall lives here, and a lot of other bands that we book are out here too. I think cost of living has something to do with it. There's a different quality of life you can have in Los Angeles, and there's a lot of new energy here that’s really exciting.
In New York right now I feel there's been a bit of a lull in the music community. The integral, community-based venues in New York have shut down in the last few years because of gentrification in certain areas. So a lot of those businesses have opened new venues in L.A. Plus there are more music industry people out here in general seeing artists play — labels, managers and agents.
Ross: What do you think the most successful acts have in common?
Cable: A lot of the bands I work with are road warriors who have put themselves in front of their fans year-in and year-out. They tend to come from punk backgrounds and a DIY approach that's similar to where I've come out of the music industry too. We’ve been able to accomplish more than a lot of people thought. I've worked with Mac and Ty probably since they were twenty-one, and they've since been able to have careers, buy houses and establish a solid foot in the music industry while staying true to their beliefs and having fun.
Ross: How did you start from a DIY background to running a boutique company with marquee artists?
Cable: I grew up in a small town in Northern California called Eureka. It's kind of like Twin Peaks, very mysterious and enchanting. I always loved music and writing, so when I was fifteen I started my own fanzine called Panache. I'd go to shows, interview bands, write reviews and quirky stories. The zine grew from four hundred copies to forty thousand copies. I started organizing these magazine release parties every two months, and from there I moved to San Francisco and booked tours on the west coast while working at a retro sneaker shop. Just by myself I was putting together a weird, niche roster of artists. I got to know all the venues, booked South by Southwest, and worked with a lot of international bands. Then I started having agents working for me to diversify the roster and kept expanding.
Ross: What are some of the challenges you've had as a woman in a male-dominated industry?
Cable: There are definitely a lot of people who discounted what I was capable of, which maybe worked in my favor because I wasn't expected to persevere and grow the company. But it's not about gender, it's about the individual, work ethic and how passionate you are. Panache has unintentionally become an all-female run company — it's small but with all women agents right now. There's definitely a lot of sexism but I've always held my head up strong and focused on the love of music.
Ross: Zooming out, what does a booking agent do exactly?
Cable: I spend my day routing tours for the artists I work with, getting holds from a variety of promoters and venues, and then eventually getting offers and presenting them to the artists. There's a lot of negotiations that go back and forth. Then you get into advancing the show — detailing the time they're playing, who the opening acts are, how much the show costs. Everything a show can be, I'm pretty much responsible for.
Ross: Are there any secrets to planning a tour?
Cable: I've noticed that keeping a tour to three weeks or less is always good for band morale, especially for trying to keep personal lives healthy. And the routing will depend on where an artist is from, and the markets where they have the most support. At Panache a lot of what we do is very specific to the artist. We don't put someone on a grid and say "Play these venues." It also depends on how willing an artist is to drive. Most bands try to keep driving to six hours or less. Some people need to have a day off or they'll lose their voice. There are a lot of variables.
Some artists have tour support from labels. And some artists from other countries have grants from Canada, Europe and Australia. But a lot of our artists don't have tour support so they need to make sure the tour at least breaks even. Expenses will depend on how many people are in the band, how much equipment and merch you're bringing, if there's a tour manager or a driver.
Ross: What are the different types of deals you can make on behalf of an artist?
Cable: There are straightforward guarantees, with extra money back to the artist if the show sells over expenses. And there are door deals where you get a gross percentage. The deal I really like is when you're getting a guarantee, but if the percentage of the door is bigger, you get that instead.
It's a hard industry because with smaller artists, agencies are waiting until after the tour to get paid. We're organizing tours six to ten months in advance so the payoff is way later. And the customary rate now is ten percent gross of what the band makes going to the agency.
Ross: Should emerging artists try to find a booking agent immediately?
Cable: Try to do everything yourself first. Book shows for yourself, understand what a publicist does, understand what a booking agent does. There are so many podcasts, blogs and panels you can go to. Understand the way the music industry works. The more knowledgeable you are about the world you're entering into, the better equipped you'll be to navigate through it when you do start to have opportunities.
One of the first things any young burgeoning band needs is a booking agent. Then a good publicist helps, then a label helps, then slowly a manager will come into the picture. Sometimes it’s the reverse order. But with any of those roles, it’s important to know what that person does in their job so you know if someone's doing the right work for you. I always like when artists book shows on their own because they have a greater understanding of how it works, and a greater appreciation of what I do.
Ross: How does a band break through to an agency like Panache?
Cable: There's a lot of competition out there. It's hard to filter through all that, even if a band's amazing. We're a small boutique agency, and I probably still get thirty to forty submissions every couple of days. And I try to listen!
The bands that stick out to me frequently are those opening up for an artist I already work with. Or word of mouth. A lot of the bands we work with were introduced to us by other bands on the roster, affiliated with someone in some way. A band is suddenly on the top of the list because I've seen their name two or three different places from various sources. Not even press, but internally through people I know in the music industry. Everyone's really supportive in the indie rock community. If you can make friends, people will start talking about your music — in addition to the music being good of course.
Ross: Is there a certain email etiquette musicians should follow?
Cable: Keep it short, link to something streamable like SoundCloud or Bandcamp (don’t include attachments), mention if you've gotten certain press, and add how you know the person that you're emailing — it's always better if you can include some connection there. In the subject, have it be basic about your band or write if someone recommended you. And that's it!
I try to check out everything that comes my way and send it around to the other agents at the company. Sometimes people cold call, which I wouldn't recommend because that can be very annoying. It's fine to check in on someone, but after you've exchanged a couple emails, let it be. Try not to over-email someone, and make sure you're emailing the right person.
Ross: How do you know if you’re working with the right agent?
Cable: If you're at the point of hiring a booking agent, I think it's good to ask questions. Do research on who worked with them, ask a band on the roster if they like working with this person. It can be a detrimental mistake to sign up with somebody who is the wrong fit just because you're anxious to get a booking agent. It’s always a red flag if a band had three agents or three managers or three publicists. First impressions are really important.
Ross: How quickly does a band start making money once they join the roster?
Cable: I think a lot of bands have this idea that once they have a booking agent they're suddenly going to make money. You want to be really careful about that too. Going on tour isn't just about making money, it's about connecting to fans and spreading your music around the world. You want to make sure you're playing in rooms that are comfortable for the fans and the artist, with good sound in the right neighborhood and a bar that's affordable.
You can play a bunch of shows and maybe make guarantees. But if there's nobody at those shows, what’s the point of going on that tour? And you don't want to burn bridges by losing promoters’ money. I'm all about strategizing for the long run. I've worked with Ty for ten years, and Mac for five years, Thee Oh Sees for seven years. That model is one we've proved can work.
Ross: Are there big differences between the smaller and bigger shows you put together?
Cable: I've always seen the advantages of doing smaller DIY shows to a specific fan-base, because you're reaching kids that will actually be there for a really long time. I think it's important for artists to play a room that fans will want to go to and enjoy experiencing. It's being aware of what those places are and how cultures shift. And it generally sounds better in a smaller room.
There's also a necessary growth that needs to happen, like playing certain venues that also are booked by festival promoters. There's a balance of putting your foot in both worlds. So after playing a place like Terminal 5 or the Greek Theater, an artist will maybe play a residency that’s more intimate.
Ross: What was your favorite show ever?
Cable: The one that comes to mind first is Electric Light Orchestra at Hollywood Bowl this past September with a full orchestra. It was amazing.
Ross: Wrapping up, I ask all my guests for three practical pieces of advice for emerging artists.
Cable: First, do your homework on how other bands have done it. Everyone has a different story on how they've grown out of their social circle. A lot of bands in other countries were not as popular in their hometown until they were popular in the rest of the world. Go to panels, read articles, read artist biographies.
Second, it's important to play in front of people who are not your friends. Just book yourself a show outside of your town. Maybe no one will come, but you'll learn a lot from that experience. It's not that hard to book yourself in a neighboring city. That will challenge you to see how your music does in front of strangers. And that can be a very traumatic experience, but it’s a good learning experience too.
Third, on a broader scale, is to not be discouraged by one disappointing situation because those will exist throughout an entire career. You can't have one incident determine how you look at yourself and your music. There's going to be a lot of people that support you, and a lot of people that don't. Try to stay positive and persisting.
