By Stephen "Breadman" Edwards

The Daily Bread Mailbag returns with Stephen "Breadman" Edwards tackling topics such as Shawn Porter vs. Yordenis Ugas, Genandy Golovkin, Errol Spence vs. Mikey Garcia, the politics of boxing, and more.

Bread -

Quick FOD question.  If GGG had gotten the decisions vs. Canelo (I personally believe he deserved both, hence the question) isn’t he runaway FOD?

Bread’s Response: Good question. Most likely GGG would have won FOD but I think he would still have some detractors because he wasn’t dominant vs Jacobs or Canelo. If GGG would have stopped Jacobs and Canelo he’s the FOD easy. 20+ title defenses, PPV star, Ko artist, undisputed champion and dominant in big fights.

But if my Aunt had a #@$% she would be my uncle. I’ve said it many, many times. This era’s cherry picking mentality. The wait and see mentality screwed GGG over. By the time he commanded the BIG PPV fights, he was past it. And he didn’t have the power to demand the fights in 2012 and 2013. I don’t want to keep going into it because it is what it is. It’s boxing. No fighter will get every super fight in their primes. Leonard vs Hearns 1 is rare.

What an unbelievable call on the Porter vs Ugas decision! You not only predicted how Porter would fight but you predicted the exact decision. That was the best prediction I have ever heard until I went on youtube and saw you do the same thing with Pacquiao vs Bradley 1.

My question is do you feel Porter really won? I don’t and I feel gutted for Ugas. What do you make of the no knockdown call and what do you make of the scoring of the 12th round? Cuban fighters really catch a tough break.

Bread’s Response: First off I want to say Shawn Porter and Yordenis Ugas both fought excellent fights. Porter was spry, his movement was good and that was the sharpest I have seen him look. And Ugas can really fight. Boy can he bump. He’s a tough technician.

I feel bad for Shawn because he’s just a fighter. He shouldn’t have to explain why the decision was the way it was. That being said naked eye with no pen and paper, I thought Ugas won 7-5 at worst he deserved 6-6 for a draw. I also think that there was a missed knockdown call.

When I saw the judges for the fight I said to myself these are good judges, hopefully nothing controversial happens. I don’t remember what judges had what scorecards. But I do think 117-111 Ugas was too much Ugas and 116-112 Porter was way too much Porter. Ugas didn’t win 9 rounds and Porter certainly didn’t win 8.

I’m glad you brought up the 12th round. I thought Ugas won the 12th round pretty clean. Scoring is subjective but the consensus is Ugas won that round. I think even Shawn felt Ugas won that round. His body language was not exuberant after the 12th.

I also feel gutted for Ugas. If Ugas wins that fight he gets a 7 figure fight in his very next fight. Because he lost he will make between 200-400k. His salary is also controlled after a lost where as after a win he has more bargaining leverage. That’s a huge difference in boxing and it’s a secret that everyone knows. Also if Ugas does fight Porter again who’s to say he can win. Porter was the favorite for a reason. Ugas wanted his justice on that night. He shouldn’t have to win twice in order to get credit for it once.

Maybe the officials have a valid subjective point of view. But I think it needs to be heard. I think judges and referees should be held publicly accountable. Especially when their judgment is 80% different from the consensus opinion.

Jack Reiss is a great referee. He has been praised for his handling of the Wilder vs Fury fight. The knockdown in the Ugas vs Porter fight was not super clear cut although I think it was a knockdown. It was a cuffing shot that landed sort of off. But Porter wasn’t falling before he was hit. Ugas didn’t trip him. And because of the punch Porter went down. Marvin Hagler has one official knockdown scored against him vs Juan Roldan and it looked similar. I think Porter’s was more obvious. I can understand Reiss thinking it was a slip I just think he needs to explain it.

I also feel as though whichever judge had Porter winning the 12th needs to explain. Maybe they have valid explanations. Maybe not. But there has to be accountability. Boxing needs a board of inquiry. An official just can’t say, “well that’s my opinion” and that be the final determination.

Now is also time for 5 judges. 3 judges get it wrong too often. Boxing needs 5 judges, one on each side of the ring and one scoring the fight from a TV monitor so he gets the same view as the fans.

After every fight, judging needs to be reviewed. Despite the myth, a close fight can be a robbery if clear rounds are scored OFF.

I am not outraged that Porter won. IF he gets the benefit of a few swing rounds he could have possibly won 7-5. But the missed knockdown and 12th round for Porter is a topic that needs discussion.

The reason why is because 90% of the time it happens to the B side fighter. That call rarely goes against the A side fighter. The fighter with big plans scheduled. The fighter who makes the promoter more money. The fighter who is making more money. Someone is going to have to explain why this almost always happens to the B side.

Mauricio Herrera kept getting bad decisions until he was no longer in his prime and he never won the title. It’s no guarantee that a fighter will eventually get the title. Every camp takes you up or down. Scoring has to be correct in real time. Fighters don’t always get the make up call. Winky Wright is rare. He persevered. Ugas is now 21-4 he may not be able to.

I have seen judges literally fall asleep at the judging table. I have personally seen two fights where there was confusion as to who would walk down first and the fighter that walked down first, who is assumed to be the B side got terrible decisions against them. I think in both of these cases, the judges mistakenly gave out the wrong scorecards and never spoke up.

I am not accusing anyone of doing anything corrupt. People make mistakes. But you have to be accountable for your actions.

This was not an easy fight to score overall. But Ugas was landing the best punch of the fight. A counter right hand over Porter’s jab. That punch was the most noticeable and cleanest punch of the fight. He should have gotten more credit for it.

At the end of the day no remedy will satisfy Ugas because he feels he won on that night. But an immediate rematch is as fair as you can get. I think because of the knockdown and 12th round scoring, Ugas has a serious case with the WBC for an immediate rematch. Let’s see what happens, poor Mauricio Herrera never got any rematches for his close controversial losses.

Big props to both Ugas and Porter. They really fought a tough fight and gave it all they had.

Why is it that Keith Thurman is pleading to fight Manny Pacquiao but when Errol Spence was available and Thurman wouldn’t say a word? I know you have never called anybody specifically of ducking Spence but it’s just so obvious that Thurman wants no part of Spence. Pacquiao will get bigger fights than Spence could ever imagine.

Bread’s Response: All I can say is it pays to be a smaller aging superstar.

Bread,

Boxing is kind of in an odd flux at this current moment. New promotional arms (PBC/Eddie Hearn) and content platforms (DAZN) are dominating the sport while the old guards are all but gone, if not erased from existence entirely (Don King, HBO). The Heavyweight Division, is cascaded with THREE legitimate SUPERSTARS, all with.varying claims to the sports most prized throne. That’s the good news. The bad news is all three are tied to separate promotional entities & broadcasters, none of whom are particularly fond of each other & for whom a reason to risk their stake in the claim to the  World’s Heavyweight Championship readily. Deontay Wilder is reportedly negotiating with DAZN, which theoretically SHOULD bring us closer to Wilder/Joshua, the biggest fight in boxing. We’ve been here before though and I’m not holding my breath.

Who’s to blame? I got one am fatigued by the “boxing politics “ narrative. If fighters REALLY want to fight each other it would happen-this isn’t to say the Arums, Hearns, Haymons and whoever minds the shop for Oscar when he’s picking fights with people on social media and other influence peddlers aren’t to partly to blame-they clear are and all serve their own agendas, none of which betters boxing by any incremental margin. Still the hound is on the fighters to dare to be great and maybe just maybe, do what’s right for boxing.

Because when we get one of those rare occasions, their is nothing like the sport of boxing.

The biggest star in boxing, Canelo Alvarez is also it’s most polarizing, eclipsing the moribund

Floyd Mayweather in that regard. His popularity is enormous, as is the degree of hostility a large spectrum of the fan base focuses on him. He is a cheater-this is fact, who more so than any fighter in recent memory appears to get the benefit of the doubt in every close round of every close fight he’s in. There are no special victories, where he distanced himself from his peers. But his resume remains untouchable, even his harshest critics (myself included) must agree his level of competition is beyond reproach. Ironically, he shares much in come with his Promoter Oscar De La Hoya in that matter-another perceived matinee idol who fought what amounts to All TimeGreat competition. I expect Alvarez/Jacobs to be nick tuck for the entire night, but Canelo’s flashier offense and less reluctance to rise in the moment will carry him to a hotly disputed decision. I don’t know what that does for his legacy, he’s rapidly becoming akin to  the heel wrestling champ, who comes into town and defends his title against the hometown babyface and narrowly escaped with something more than defeat, but less than true victory.

I like Mikey Garcia by unanimous 12RD Decision Saturday night over Errol Spence. I just believe in Garcia’s apparent confidence and self awareness that this is his snapshot moment in time, the fork in the road which will separate himself from other great fighters of his era. His entire career has been building to this moment. I don’t have any data or strategic inertia to fall back on. Only to say I think his game-plan and attack will be basic, jabs and straight rights- right down the middle. To me it comes down to Spence’s will and how much he can impose it on Mikey and his belief in his own greatness. We shall see Saturday night.

Mythical Match UPS

Mathew Saad Muhammad/Bob Foster (175lbs)

Thomas Hearns/Bernard Hopkins (160lbs)

Pernell Whitaker/Shane Mosely (135lbs)

Wilfred Benitez/Paul Williams (147lbs)

Mike McCallum/Tito Trinidad (154lbs)

Joe Calzage/James Toney (168lbs)

*For the record , I think Foster stops Saad Muhammad late after unleashing a brutal amount of punishment...Hopkins takes away The Hit Man’s cross, but Hearns uses his jab to outscore Hopkins enough in an ugly fight...Sweet Pea turns Mosely with angles all night and decisions him by a wide margin....Benitez walk Williams into about 663 straight right hands and wins a lopsided decision...Trinidad and McCallum engage a tense chess match early, exchanging knockdowns and eventually catalyze into a Trinidad 12th Round knockout..and Joe Calzaghe’s work-rate gains him a hotly disputed split decsion.

Best Regards,

TomG

Bread’s Response: No one is to blame for the rise of PBC, DAZN and ESPN. It’s evolution.

When a fight doesn’t get made there is always fault. But unless you’re privy to behind the scenes nuances you won’t know the truth. By rule I always place more blame on the A side. The A side fighter has more leverage, therefore he has a bigger platform to make something work. He can offer more money and make more concessions, where as the B side has leverage but his leverage comes in the form of request. The A side’s comes in forms of offers.

Canelo and Oscar are very similar. Both fought killers and both were in a bunch of close controversial fights. Good analogy.

So you like Mikey….

Saad vs Foster. I don’t like Foster by as much as you. I think Foster is historically better and can beat more people but on Saad’s very best night I think he can clip Foster. It’s just gut reaction to their styles. Foster engages with his hands down and Saad is almost as good a puncher and he’s actually more resilient and physically stronger. Saad will punch with Foster.

Hearns tight decision over Bhop. Bhop has the better legacy at 160 but that doesn’t mean he’s the overall better fighter. Authoritative jabbers always give Hopkins trouble. Jermaine Taylor is a B rated version of Hearns without the 1 punch ko ability, length and hand speed. But say what you want about the decisions, no one can deny there was not much room between the two for 24 rounds.

Whitaker vs Mosley is closer than you think. Whitaker I agree would win but not in a dominating performance. His mind sharpness would allow him to land cleaner shots. But Mosley is a rough out for any lightweight ever. He’s tall for the weight, he’s a volume puncher and he has an iron chin. I think this would be an ugly fight because both grappled. I say Whitaker 116-112 in a hard fight.

I like Benitez big over Paul Williams. I love Williams but Benitez is just better. Too slick, too smooth, too much ring generalship. I think he outclasses Williams in a bad style match up for Williams.

Most people would pick McCallum. I think this is a great fight that could go either way. I have seen all of McCallum’s title fights at 154 as well Tito’s. I think Tito would win this fight. I think he’s a little quicker and his punches are more dynamic. McCallum would be right with him step for step but my gut tells me the judges would look at what Tito is doing to McCallum more than what McCallum would be doing to Tito.

Most people pick Calzaghe over Toney stating a bad style for Toney. When Toney was on and motivated he was able to conquer tougher styles than we have ever saw Calzaghe conquer. Toney beat an undefeated Michael Nunn who is similar to Calzaghe. He also beat Reggie Johnson who was a terrific fighter. We have never seen Calzaghe beat a style close to Toney’s. I say they have to fight 3 times to settle it. Toney was a good as a fighter I have ever seen at adapting up until the Roy Jones fight.

Bread, short and simple: if Garcia beats Spence and Crawford, is he fighter of the decade?

thanks,

Bread’s Response: Man….I just don’t know. I will tell you what it would be the BEST win of the Decade. It would make the argument tougher. But other than Spence, Mikey doesn’t have what you call great wins. Good question I just don’t know.

Hello from London Bread,

Wanted to say that the mailbag is turning me from a mere fan into a boxing scholar. I tend to read it after my daughter’s bed-time story, while she falls asleep. So, I am at my most calm and receptive! Thanks for the thought you put in. I’ll join the call for you to produce a podcast. You’d have a tonne of listeners.

A lot of excited chatter going around about Garcia v Spence, and rightly so. It’s an intriguing match-up. And one with some chance of an historic upset. Someone wetting their pants online said ‘it would be the greatest victory ever’ if Garcia won. Hold up. While it would be a TERRIFIC win – the greatest ever? It got me thinking: what ARE the best, greatest single victories in the sport. Some big ones come to mind:

Ali v Foreman

Frasier v Ali

Duran v Leonard

What are your top 5 or 10 best victories for a boxer? Not necessarily ‘best fights’ but most meaningful, difficult or unlikely triumphs? I’d be really interested to know.

And are there any fights from the last 15 years that produced an ATG victory for a boxer?

Last thing, so I can keep this short – a mythical match-up:

Duran (the version who took Hagler 15 rounds) v GGG. I think Duran gets it on points because of GGG’s lack of infighting and ‘your turn, my turn’ style when trading. Duran would make it ‘my turn, my turn’.

Take it easy,

Giuseppe.

Bread’s Response: As good as GGG is people don’t realize he’s not really an infighter. He just punches on the inside because he’s a brutal puncher who can overwhelm. Duran, Toney and Armstrong are what you call infighters. GGG is a big puncher who happens to be able to hit you anywhere and stop you. But he doesn’t sit in the inside box and work like those guys do.

GGG also has a style of your turn, my turn. Great analysis. You can’t be like that with Duran. Duran will muffle your attack. Stylistically GGG is made for Duran. But the physical difference is a problem for Roberto the Magician.

The dilemma for Duran would be GGG’s jab, physicality and workrate. Duran would be in the pocket so he would be available to get cracked. I really can’t call this fight but I wouldn’t be surprised if Duran won.

Any wins in the last 15 years that were ATG wins. Since 2003 in no order…..I would say Roman Gonzalez over Juan Estrada,

Bernard Hopkins over Antonio Tarver

 Manny Pacquiao over Miguel Cotto,

Manny Pacquiao over Marco Antonio Barrera,

Erik Morales over Manny Pacquiao,

Juan Manuel Marquez over Manny Pacquiao,

Floyd Mayweather over Canelo Alvarez,

Antonio Tarver over Roy Jones,

Andre Ward over Carl Froch,

James Toney over Vasyl Jirov

Miguel Cotto over Sergio Martinez 

Guillermo Rigondeaux over Nonito Donaire.

Canelo Alvarez over GGG.

Top 5 to 10 victories ever. In no order.

Ali over Foreman

Frazier over Ali

Duran over Leonard.

Leonard over Hearns

Leonard over Hagler

Armstrong over Ross

Robinson over Lamotta

Johnson over Jeffries

Greb over Tunney

Pep over Saddler

I have been following your mailbag since way back when you did them on BoxingTalk. You really know your stuff so respect to you for that and I rarely see you being wrong and even though your final prediction is still Spence by KO , I think you are overrating Mikey and overestimating the amount of success he will have in the fight. To me, he has literally no chance of winning, I have noticed Mikey is less agile and his stamina has worsened. This could be because of the added weight and age. To me, Mikey is on the decline. I actually scored the Lipinets fight a draw as I outlined in this thread: https://www.boxingscene.com/forums/showthread.php?t=809373

Mikey fights better when he is in rhythm and can dictate the pace. Spence will not allow him to do that. Mikey has a weak inside game. He is technically sound but a huge part of boxing is athleticism. I could see from Mikey's facial expressions that he was affected by body shots by Lipinets. I also noticed that Mikey has a habit of launching an attack once his opponent successfully delivers one of their own. This could get him knocked out vs Spence. Mikey also throws the right hand way too often behind the jab, it becomes predictable ala Deontay Wilder.

  Anyways, enjoy the fight. Jas.

Bread’s Response: Thank you. I appreciate all of my knowledgeable hardcore guys who write in. But in this case I think you’re trying to be too smart.

You’re actually scoring from a different point system where you’re trying to assess the level of power shot a person lands. That’s not realistic, my man. And I think you’re just too smart for that. You know boxing and you know this scoring method is not feasible.

A fight is scored on 4 things. Those 4 things become complicated in real time and now you want to add something that can only be done if you review a video several times which is something a judge can’t do. It’s totally counterproductive and could be never be used in any fashion.

Lipinets fought well vs Garcia. But Mikey Garcia won that fight. Mikey won between 7-9 rounds clean with a knockdown. Come on man. This is a pet peeve of mine because national media members and fans alike insert their subjective preference and it causes false narratives. I can remember when people tried to say Tim Bradley really beat Pacquiao in their 1st fight. I love Tim Bradley. But he didn’t win that fight and he knows it. The most you could give Tim was 5 rounds. But there were people actually saying “I scored it for Tim.” No way. You’re doing the same thing with Garcia vs Lipinets.

What’s your official pick for Spence vs Garcia? I saw it ESPN but I haven’t seen it on boxingscene. I need the breqkdown also not just the pick.

Bread’s Response: My breakdown is both guys will come out probing with their lead hands. I think both will try to establish jabs but the jabs could offset each other’s. I am curious as to how Mikey will overcome Errol’s jab. Errol has one of the 5 best jabs in boxing. It’s a sledgehammer and it’s accurate and disruptive.

Mikey will look for a counter right hand. If Mikey lands this shot within the first 2 rounds Spence’s night will be tougher. The reason being is when elite boxer punchers can land a power counter shot early, it usually allows them to catch their rhythm. Look for Mikey to try to land a clean counter early.

I believe Mikey will compete on even terms in the 1st half of the fight as far as points are concerned. The issue is attrition. Errol is a SOB when it comes down to attrition. He never stops digging brutal body shots in. Mikey has short arms that don’t come down over his trunk line so look for Spence to get through to that body.

Mikey will have to really make Errol pay when he goes to the body. If he doesn’t he’s in trouble. Errol shovels his left hand through the inside of the guard and it hits either the liver or solar plexus. Then he brings the right hook around to the flank which really sucks the wind out of you. The gift that Errol has is you can’t rest with him. Mikey has to keep the fight in the center of the ring and really crack Errol to stop the bulldozing.

I think Mikey will visibly buzz Errol and the more Errol lays back and boxes the more Mikey will get off. But at some point Errol will start to try to be the savage he really is. And he will attack Mikey. I think Mikey will raise his game and give Errol all he wants but there is a huge physicality difference in the two.

At some point I think Mikey’s nose will start to show serious damage. See the Salido and Broner fights. Errol will keep going, keep digging and keep chopping away. In a brutal slugfest I think Mikey will finally capitulate between rounds 9-11. I think we will see a tremendous fight. Both of these dudes have that look in their eye. Expect blood, lumps, bruises, knockdowns and high drama. Let’s hope the officials and announcers get everything right also. This fight sells itself and boxing doesn’t need any more bad calls or false narratives.

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